IMSLP Forums

Hello all!

I am hoping to do my Grade 8 violin exam by Spring 2010, and so I have begun looking at the pieces available to see which ones I would want to do (and which ones I can actually play!). However, rather than buying all the pieces (which would be rather dim-witted, not to mention expensive) I have been looking for the scores on this site, and I am pleased to say that I found some. However, there still some which I would very much like to look at as well:

List 'A' Pieces

1) Albinoni - Allemanda (Larghetto) and Corrente (Allegro): 1st and 2nd movts from Sonata in G minor, So33
2) Vivaldi - Allegro: 1st movt from Concerto in E, Op. 3 No. 12, RV 265 (priority, as I feel I would be more confident with Vivaldi than with anyone else)

List 'B' Pieces

1) Delius - Slow: 1st movt from Sonata No. 3.

And I've already decided my List 'C' piece (Monti - Czardas... )

Thank you all ever so much, this is a wonderful site.

From what I've heard, you and your piano accompanist need to bring along the original copies by ABRSM when you're sitting for your violin exam, and the examiner will take issue should you bring a photocopy or other copies not endorsed or printed by ABRSM.

What Vivaldi says is correct, although I'm not sure it is legal to insist on originals for music that is no longer protected by copyright law. However, these examining boards have the power to simply refuse to mark the exam, at least until they acknowledge the fact that it is legal to photocopy public domain music. And when they are protecting their own publishing businesses, that doesn't seem likely in the near future.

On their side, though is the argument that every examiner would have to become somewhat of an expert on what public domain editions exist for each item on the lists, kind of like a Carolus-type person. I don't think it's that difficult, but it does add an extra dimension of admin to the examiners' jobs, and it is much simpler to say they won't allow any photocopies.

I still get stuck, though, on the fact that photocopying public domain music isn't illegal, so it can't legally be prohibited . . . . .

In any case, most of these exams have a 20th century list, in the case of ABRSM, the B list. You might find early 20th century music on that list that is public domain, but most of what is on those lists will still be under copyright.

For the rest, you can send them an email and ask about public domain editions, but I don't think you'll get very far.

Interestingly (and annoyingly) enough, Trinity gave us a hard time a couple of years ago because they didn't want anyone even using library copies that were originals. One examiner maintained that each child had to have his own copy (increases their publishing income, although she wouldn't say that was the reason). I did take it up with the Head of Trinity when he came here on a visit. We do a lot of work with disadvantaged communities, and requiring each child to purchase 3 or 4 books a year is out of the question. He maintained that his examiners were told to allow library copies, that he thought he knew which examiner it was, and that he would speak to her. Guess what? The next year we were given a hard time about library copies again.

For this reason alone, I use ABRSM more than Trinity, and Trinity only when a student doesn't have the theory requirement for ABRSM. It seems to be only a matter of time before Trinity disqualifies someone for using a library copy.

Kind of like saying that if you want to read a novel, you can't read the library's copy . . . . .

The Beethoven IS available at IMSLP (its on the 2nd page of Beethoven scores).

http://imslp.org/wiki/Violin_Sonata_No. ... wig_van%29

Likewise the Mozart is available here:

http://imslp.org/wiki/Violin_Sonata,_K. ... Amadeus%29

The best readily available edition of the Vivaldi is to be found in the complete L'Estro Armonico printed by Dover where you'll find 11 other great Vivaldi concerti. But that is in full score only and is not edited for performance purposes. It is also under copyright.

While the ABRSM policies can, at times, smell like a racket or monopoly, there may be a good musical reason for insistence on a specific score (which is not to say that the following is their reasoning). If you look at either the Beethoven or Mozart scores, they are heavily edited, by Joachim and Flesch, respectively. If you perform either score precisely as printed you'll end up with a performance by Joachim or Flesch, not your own, which is what I assume an ABRSM examiner will be looking for at this level of proficiency (as a violinist myself I would have a hard time with the Beethoven). Insistence on a specific edition will help ensure that any musical expression not on the standardized printed page (embodied in phrasing, articulation, dynamics, rubato. choice of fingering etc.) comes from you, not the music's editors. It also makes a level playing field for all the performers. To an examiner, an extraordinary talent would immediately be evident.

But this puts the responsibility on ABRSM to provide scores that faithfully convey as much as possible the composer's original intent before any violin-virtuoso editor has had a chance to impose an interpretation (remember, for example, that neither Beethoven nor Mozart wrote any fingering in their violin music and all printed fingering is a later editor's interpretation). I know that the latest ABRSM edition of the Beethoven Piano Sonatas is a superb example of such work but do not know if such diligence has been applied to their violin publications. For editions of the Beethoven and Mozart with more restrained editing, therefore, I'd recommend the Henle or Barenreiter "Urtext" editions. But these will probably cost more than the ABRSM publications and are under copyright (though the Mozart can be viewed online and it is instructive to compare with the Flesch edition to see how much Flesch has added, which is quite a bit). The Mozart can be accessed through the following link (though it takes some digging to get to the piece you want in the Chamber Music area and you might have to click on the British flag link to get the pages to appear in English):

http://www.mozarteum.at/03_Wissenschaft ... Online.asp

I hope this all has helped and not been too confusing.

--Sixtus

Thank you all very much, you have been most helpful.

However, I am slightly confused:

Vivaldi wrote:From what I've heard, you and your piano accompanist need to bring along the original copies by ABRSM when you're sitting for your violin exam, and the examiner will take issue should you bring a photocopy or other copies not endorsed or printed by ABRSM.

I was of the opinion that you had to buy any old version of the song (and that there was no single "Grade 8 Violin" book), and that the versions listed in the syllabus (e.g. the Vivaldi piece has 'Peters EP 4379' next to it, which I presume is the publisher and the... code) were simply a guideline. Could you clarify this for me? My idea was to simply get as many of the scores for the syllabus as possible so I could bash through them and get a feel for them so I could identify the ones I liked most, and then buy a proper version of them.

Please forgive my ignorance. Many thanks.

Check the syllabus, because there is usually a line in there about "or any reasonable edition", or something to that effect. In the case of ABRSM it is: "Candidates may use any edition of the pieces listed in the syllabus, except where a specific arrangement or transcription is indicated. The editions quoted in the syllabus are given for guidance only and are not obligatory."

While I take Mr. Beckmesser's point about good editions, the Breitkopf & Hartel edition of the Brahms Clarinet Sonatas are available at IMSLP, because they are now PD. They are also an excellent edition, and in fact, a lot of performer's second choice after the Urtext edition. The PD status should mean that they are acceptable as a photocopy with ABRSM, and no one can really fault the edition, but they won't be allowed for exams except with an original. Actually, the same is true of the Simrock edition, also available at IMSLP.

And as for Trinity, if the reasoning were to hold to a specific reliable and excellent edition, the library copy would still be acceptable.