Old Eulenburg Brahms Symphonies, Anyone?

[nomopomo]

Hello everybody,

In "Brahms in der Meinigen Tradition," references are made not to bar numbers but to *systems* and bars within them in the old Eulenburg edition of the Symphonies --very confusing and sometimes downright impossible to know which passage Walter Blume is talking about.

Adding this edition to the IMSLP would be very helpful for those interested in that particular tradition. Fritz Steinbach's markings are a must-study for any Brahms scholar.

Many, many thanks in advance!!
David Aijón,
Spain

[sbeckmesser]

I second this request. But where does one get a copy of the Meiningen Tradition article?

--Sixtus

[sbeckmesser]

Speak of the devil! Only yesterday I responded to this request and today I found and purchased in a NYC used bookstore a bound mini-score copy the Brahms Symphonies that I believe was the source of the old Eulenburg mini scores (my volume was published by Simrock with plate numbers 11360 - 11363). The page layouts are different from the IMSLP first-edition full scores as well as my new-Eulenburg mini score of the 2nd Symphony. If somebody could supply me with a copy in any form of the Blume/Steinbach article referred to ("Brahms in der Meininger Tradition", Surkamp 1933) I'll not only verify that these are the desired scores I will also scan and post them AND I might even take the trouble to translate the article into English and post it. If I do that I'll convert the Steinbach citations to modern bar numbers, usable with any score (including the new and important critical editions now being issued by Henle).

Several decades ago while back in college doing research on Wagner's tempo modifications, I paged through a microfilm copy of the Steinbach article {it was pages in typescript, not a real "book"). Since I wasn't making a detailed study of Brahms I took no detailed notes, unfortunately (nor did I request a printed copy). But what has stayed with me all these years was Steinbach's insistence on the performance of the notated dynamic nuances (crescendi, diminuendi, hairpins, accents etc.) so that they are indeed vividly audible to the audience. These markings are NOT, as in many modern performances, merely "hints" for the performers but are an integral part of the music itself, and therefore must be heard as written.

--Sixtus (sbeckmesser@yahoo.com)

[Carolus]

That appears to be an interesting collection, sbeckmesser. I wonder if this was a joint issue with Simrock and Eulenburg, which was often done back in the early 1900s. Typically, Eulenburg would actually engrave the scores, and the original publisher would simultaneously issue study scores under their own imprint. There are a number of cases already posted where Belaieff did this. Peters and other publishers apparently made similar deals with Eulenburg as well. Sometimes, Eulenburg would simply reproduce the original publisher's score in reduced format, but they actually re-engraved the piece more often than not. At any rate, feel free to post them here. I'm sure we can fit them in nicely on the Brahms Symphony pages.