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Speaking of great beginnings, the similar openings of the Mendelssohn and Sibelius Violin Concertos are terrifying for soloists and conductors. These pieces also end with great flourishes on the solo violin. And I like how the John Adams Violin Concerto ends in mid-sentence, as it were, suddenly breaking off in a cadenza-like passage for the soloist.

--Sixtus

The Noon Witch by Dvorak is another piece with a fantastic finish. It is one of those endings that makes you crave for more Dvorak.

Till Eulenspiegels Lustige Streiche - Richard Strauss
Handel in the Strand - Percy Grainger
Jupiter - Gustav Holst
La Gazza Ladra Overture - Gioachino Rossini

I also have to say the ending to Charles Ives's Country Band March is great too. Who agrees?

In no precise order:

Best Openings
Beethoven: Symphonies nr. 3, 5 and 9, piano concerto N°5
Mozart: Eine Kleine Nachtmusik (of course), all his main operas really, Piano concerto nr. 23
Bach: h-moll mass (KYYYYYYYYRIEEEEEEEEEEEEE!)
Schubert: 8th symphony
Mahler: 1st symphony
Smetana: Ma vlast (the Moldau)
Mendelssohn: 4th symphony
Brahms: 4th symphony
Bizet: Carmen (surprised no one mentionned it yet!)
Tchaikovsky: Piano Concerto N°1
Sibelius: 2nd symphony


Best Endings
Beethoven: symphonies nr. 5, 7 and 9, violin concerto in D
Mozart: Don Giovanni (I am obviously referring to DG's death, not the fake, corny, politically correct coda Mozart added after), Die Entfuhrung aus dem Serail
Dvorak: 8th symphony
Brahms: 2nd symphony
Mahler: 4th symphony
Moussorgsky: Boris Godunov
Bruckner: 2nd symphony
Sibelius: 5th symphony


I probably forgot a ton of great pieces, but these few just jump to mind when I think about great openings or endings

Sergeï wrote:Best Endings

Mozart: Don Giovanni (I am obviously referring to DG's death, not the fake, corny, politically correct coda Mozart added after)

When it is omitted, as in Klemperer's recording, I miss this coda terribly. It is structurally a long and necessary affirmation of D major after the unstable chromaticism of the preceding scene. That scene has always struck me as having too short an ending, too short an affirmation of its Picardy-third D major for the work to end there. Perhaps Mozart planned this deliberately, since the final scene is part of the autograph MSS and therefore an integral part of the whole conception. (While there are indications that the Scena Ultima was cut for the Viennese debut, after the work's premier in Prague, that cut is just another of the VIennese alterations that, if taken in whole, have the effect of reducing the dramatic intensity of the opera by altering the dramatic pace and making it longer. The cut of the Scena Ultima indicated in the autograph might merely have been to save time!). Tonally, the Scena Ultima does start, in fact, with a musical "relaxation" into the subdominant (G major) before the final shift back up to D to wrap things up. Leaving out the last scene might satisfy some dramatic tastes but it does violence to the musical values. The "coda" is also an essential part of the 18th Century dramatic aesthetic: to let the audience down easy, whether we -- and our post-Tristan, post-Wozzeck, post-Godot musical ears and dramatic sensitivities -- like it or not. It is the direct descendant of the "jigs" that were probably danced after most of Shakespeare's plays, including the tragedies, in his (Shakespeare's) time. Only someone who as experienced one of these (as was done in a recent Broadway production of the comedy Boeing, Boeing) knows what a cathartic effect such a custom can have. In sum, I think the true Scena Ultima of Don Giovanni is just fine as Mozart left it and would indeed include it on my list of Best Endings.

--Sixtus

PS: 5 Dec 09. Having just caught "Jai Ho" (?? ??), at the end of Slumdog Millionaire on HBO, I am again reminded of the dramatic power of a final song and dance, a tried and true way to end even the most serious of dramas.

I do agree that - especially for the public, at a performance, as opposed to listening to the piece at home - ending the piece at the death scene would be, for lack of a better word, brutal. Then again, the finale is rather dramatic, so I don't feel it would have been out of place for Mozart to just brush aside the muscial conventions and not put it in at all - though you do have a point when you say that would probably be more in line with our modern tastes than with 18th century tastes. Either way, the piece remains an exceptional opera



Oh, and for great openings, one (among many others, I guess) I forgot: Mozart's 40th symphony.

Just listened to KA Hartmann's Eighth Symphony, one of my favorites of his. It has a fantastic opening. His Sixth also opens with probably the second best bassoon solo in 20th century music (After Le Sacre of course).

dwil9798 wrote:Just listened to KA Hartmann's Eighth Symphony, one of my favorites of his. It has a fantastic opening. His Sixth also opens with probably the second best bassoon solo in 20th century music (After Le Sacre of course).

I will dare to challenge you on that. What about Ravel's Mother Goose Suite (contrabasson, though), Shostakovich's Symphony No. 7 (right after the march theme), Stravinsky's Rite of Spring, and Ravel's Piano Concerto in G.

Everyone here has such a knowledge of string music, I'm intimidated XD

Since this is really my best field of knowledge, here are some for the piano category:

Best Beginning
Piano Conerto no. 1 - Tchaikovsky (Already mentioned I believe.)
Piano Concerto no. 2 - Rachmaninoff
Petrushka - Stravinsky (I'm talking about the solo piano version, of course!)
Etude op. 25 no. 11 "Winter Wind" - Chopin
Polonaise op. 40 no. 1 - Chopin

Best Ending
Ballade No. 1 - Chopin (Last 2 minutes or so is complete genius)
Hungarian Rhapsody No. 2 - Liszt (LisztHorowitz transcription http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHGnYQgLLzc)
La Campanella - Liszt
Etude Op. 8 No. 12 - Scriabin
Polonaise op. 53 No. 1 - Chopin



Oh and for strings has anyone mentioned "Thus Spoke Zarathustra" by Strauss?

allegroamabile wrote:I will dare to challenge you on that. What about Ravel's Mother Goose Suite (contrabasson, though), Shostakovich's Symphony No. 7 (right after the march theme), Stravinsky's Rite of Spring, and Ravel's Piano Concerto in G.

I did mention the Rite as the best (or at least my favorite). As for contrabassoon, the best solo is the opening of Ravel's Left Hand Piano Concerto.

As for a great ending, listen to Orff's De Temporum Fine Comoedia. The entire piece is dissonant with jarring rythyms and a huge percussion section (30 players!) until the very end. The last five minutes consists of a Bach canon played by 4 violins in harmonization. Simply stunning!

It's interesting to me that no one has mentioned any of the 600-odd works of Villa-Lobos. (Here he goes again... ) For endings, I'd pick Chôros 10, W209 (what else?)- referred to by a critic (can't remember who at the moment) as 'Brazil's answer to Beethoven's Ninth Symphony'. After several minutes of almost excruciating fortissimo choral counterpoint on top of grinding percussion and orchestra, there occurs an incredible ritardando where the choir and brass broaden out while the strings and percussion keep going, giving a feeling of expansion to fill the entire universe (sorry, can't think of any other phrase). You close your eyes and wonder if you're going to die. (At least, in a good recording, which would most certainly not include anything by John Neschling.) After the tempo reaches its nadir, the entire choir reaches upward as the lower orchestra reprises a chord progression from the opening. The final exhortation from the choir is the highest in the entire piece; no orchestra accompanies it until the final smash a few beats later.
Maybe I overreact to this piece, but...listen to it. (Although probably everyone using this forum has.)

KGill wrote:It's interesting to me that no one has mentioned any of the 600-odd works of Villa-Lobos. (Here he goes again... ) For endings, I'd pick Chôros 10, W209 (what else?)- referred to by a critic (can't remember who at the moment) as 'Brazil's answer to Beethoven's Ninth Symphony'. After several minutes of almost excruciating fortissimo choral counterpoint on top of grinding percussion and orchestra, there occurs an incredible ritardando where the choir and brass broaden out while the strings and percussion keep going, giving a feeling of expansion to fill the entire universe (sorry, can't think of any other phrase). You close your eyes and wonder if you're going to die. (At least, in a good recording, which would most certainly not include anything by John Neschling.) After the tempo reaches its nadir, the entire choir reaches upward as the lower orchestra reprises a chord progression from the opening. The final exhortation from the choir is the highest in the entire piece; no orchestra accompanies it until the final smash a few beats later.
Maybe I overreact to this piece, but...listen to it. (Although probably everyone using this forum has.)

very good ending indeed...
Just to let everyone know, Villa-Lobos has recently become public domain in Canada!

And for good beginnings, I would add Villa-Lobos's Bachianas brasileiras No. 2, "The Little Train of Caipira."

allegroamabile wrote:Just to let everyone know, Villa-Lobos has recently become public domain in Canada!

Technically, composers stay under copyright until the end of the anniversary year, so I think Villa-Lobos is still protected until Jan.1, 2010 (not long to go, though).

On another topic, I know it's not an end of a piece, but bassoon solos were discussed. My absolute favorite is the cadenza in Shostakovich's 9th Symphony bridging the 4th and 5th movement.

I must add Spohr's Clarinet Concerto No. 3 in F minor to the best beginnings list.